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09 june PCLL Conversion Exam Result

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原帖由 SuperSeiyan4 於 2009-8-7 01:39 PM 發表


What is so hard about copying from the book for those open book subjects??
Yea, I totally agree. I passed civil procedure, criminal procedure and commercial law by copying directly from the book. I passed evience by copying from the past exam reports. I didn't even bother to rephrase anything, just copied verbatim.

So much for 2000 dollars, just went in and copied.



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原帖由 presentation 於 2009-8-7 04:47 PM 發表 at this stage last year,  there were:
Still don't understand why conversion is difficult:

  • legal system exams that asked questions about a topic (ie jury system) that was NOT on the syllabus;
  • LLBor CPE must have covered the "jury" question. All one has to do is toread up some materials from a book or even from some websites, such asdepartment of jsutice. What's so difficult about that?
  • land law exam with a fail rate of 70%
  • Who said that? You have insider information?
  • Commercial law part B question asking material from part C
  • Mostpeople, if not all, have to prepare parts B and C anyway, and the examis open book. What's so difficult about copying materials supposedly tobe used in part C to answer a question in part B?
  • questions which barely relates to the syllabus
  • Such as?
  • the lack of material/past-papers available for candidates to evaluate the exams
  • Iguess most, if not all, people who would have known of PCEA website.There are past papers available, some subjects even provide verydetailed examiner reports which one could bring into the exam room andcopy! such as evidence. What's so difficult about that?
  • ..thelist goes on...  just looking at the people's faces after exams lastyear give you an indication of what they think about the exams
  • Such as?

anyways.. congrats to all this year
Sorry I don't mean to challenge you at all, I am just curious why it is so difficult.

(1)i personally didn't touch jury in my LLB... in any case... even if i did touch the jury topic in my LLB (it wouldn't be HK law)....  I doubt anyone would bring material on a "completely hidden topic" into the exam (otherwise you might as well bring in books from every subject into the exam); or even look up the topic at all during their conversion studies... just because information can be found somewhere doesnt' make the exam any easier...
it's not easy to discuss "reform" on the jury topic in the exam if you have almost no knowledge of the "jury system" in hong kong..

(2)regarding the land law exam with a high fail rate... try asking the people who did the january 2008 land paper.. you'll get an indication of how people fared... the failure rate is no secret..

(3) detailed examiner reports are available now because there are previous batches of students who have undertaken the exam..... rewind back to a year ago (i did almost all of my sittings in Jan 2008), there was at most "one" past paper that you could attempt.... I'm not sure about the syllabus now, but back then... the syllabus consists merely of the topic names... nothing more, it couldn't get much broader than that...  at least in LLB, they tell you what to study regarding each subjct

(4)Commercial Law part B question-  for most people, it wasnt' much of an issue... however, something just doesn't sound right don't you think? there's just an inherent problem with the paper's structure....

i've just completed my PCLL... and i can safely say that Conversion Papers are much harder than PCLL papers



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(1)i personally didn't touch jury in my LLB... in any case... even if i did touch the jury topic in my LLB (it wouldn't be HK law)....  I doubt anyone would bring material on a "completely hidden topic" into the exam (otherwise you might as well bring in books from every subject into the exam); or even look up the topic at all during their conversion studies... just because information can be found somewhere doesnt' make the exam any easier...
it's not easy to discuss "reform" on the jury topic in the exam if you have almost no knowledge of the "jury system" in hong kong..
I suppose most, if not all, law students should have realized jury system is a very important and integral element in Hong Kong (as well as in UK of course). The syllabus has also included "jury system". After all, one still has a choice not to pick the jury question if one thinks it's a topic that is so hidden that no reasonable law students studying Hong Kong law could have realized the importance of it. As long as one doesn't skip any topic, one would be fine. The syllabus is not big at all. One only need to read one of the introductory books and all those articles listed.
(2)regarding the land law exam with a high fail rate... try asking the people who did the january 2008 land paper.. you'll get an indication of how people fared... the failure rate is no secret..
Just because you think that it seems many people might have done bad after the exam doesn't mean the failing rate is 70%. I am merely curious how you could come up with such an accurate figure of 70%.
(3) detailed examiner reports are available now because there are previous batches of students who have undertaken the exam..... rewind back to a year ago (i did almost all of my sittings in Jan 2008), there was at most "one" past paper that you could attempt.... I'm not sure about the syllabus now, but back then... the syllabus consists merely of the topic names... nothing more, it couldn't get much broader than that...  at least in LLB, they tell you what to study regarding each subjct
Most of the syllabus consists mainly of the topic names, it has always been this way ever since. If one is careful enough to read the recommended texts as suggested, one could see how lazy the examiners really are. For example, about half of the topic headings in land law are exact copies of the big conveyancing book, even the sequence of the headings are exactly the same. The land law syllabus is very small. If one has already studied land law in his/her LLB or CPE, one wouldn't find much difficulties, except maybe one has to memorize all those tedious Chinese names in cases.
By the way, I did all my conversion in 2008.
(4)Commercial Law part B question-  for most people, it wasnt' much of an issue... however, something just doesn't sound right don't you think? there's just an inherent problem with the paper's structure....
What thing just doesn't sound right? Part B in my opinion is quite easy. I agree the reading list for commercial law is quite useless. But if one just performs a simple search in library, one could find a lot of useful information. For example, there is a whole bunch of information about floating charge in "Hong Kong Company Law" by Vanessa Stott. One could just copy the relevant pages and take it into the exam room and copy.
i've just completed my PCLL... and i can safely say that Conversion Papers are much harder than PCLL papers
That's really something I have never heard of. I hope you are right cus I really use very little time to prepare the conversion papers. I only used 3 days to prepare my evidence papers. The longest preparation time was commercial law, which was about 3 weeks. If you are really right, then I should be able to get a distinction in every PCLL subject with 2-week or so full time study for each paper.

[ 本帖最後由 presentation 於 2009-8-7 05:48 PM 編輯 ]






我所做過的捐獻必定多於你一年人工<----------本來我不想這樣說的!因為實在太私人

Stupidity reincarnates, arrogance overflows.

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引用:
原帖由 presentation 於 2009-8-7 05:47 PM 發表
(1)i personally didn't touch jury in my LLB... in any case... even if i did touch the jury topic in my LLB (it wouldn't be HK law)....  I doubt anyone would bring material on a "completely hidden topi ...
by hidden, i mean it's not on the syllabus; jury system appeared on the syllabus after it first appeared in the exam...
70% is one of the numbers they released..
not many foreign LLB students would've encountered the "small house policies" or many of the principles in HK land law

keeping things in perspective.. i'm not saying conversion is "difficult"... just not as easy as some people make it out to be..
local LLB students (and some lecturers) have seen the earlier conversion papers... and did consider them tougher than LLB standards

anyways.. it doesn't matter anyways.. a pass in conversion is a pass..  just offering my two cent.. (would it have made me more credible if i scored a distinction in my PCLL? just kidding..)

[ 本帖最後由 wajaja 於 2009-8-7 06:31 PM 編輯 ]



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原帖由 wajaja 於 2009-8-7 06:23 PM 發表
by hidden, i mean it's not on the syllabus; jury system appeared on the syllabus after it first appeared in the exam...
70% is one of the numbers they released..
not many foreign LLB students would've encountered the "small house policies" or many of the principles in HK land law

keeping things in perspective.. i'm not saying conversion is "difficult"... just not as easy as some people make it out to be..
local LLB students (and some lecturers) have seen the earlier conversion papers... and did consider them tougher than LLB standards

anyways.. it doesn't matter anyways.. a pass in conversion is a pass..  just offering my two cent..
I appreciate your opinion.

I just didn't come across 70% failing rate in land law in any official reports. Maybe I forgot or maybe I wasn't looking carefully. Personally I don't know why some people said land law is difficult at all. The syllabus is really very small. I was quite surprised at first and I had to double check with PCEA. I thought they missed out a whole chunk on co-ownership. It seems illogical for me that severance is on the syllabus while co-ownership is not.

I also didn't know anything about "small house policies" and other topics as well, such as "chinese customary trust", etc before I did my revision. I suppose if one spends an hour or so and read the several pages in the big conveyancing guide on the topics, one would understand. The concept is not difficult at all.



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我所做過的捐獻必定多於你一年人工<----------本來我不想這樣說的!因為實在太私人

Stupidity reincarnates, arrogance overflows.

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